MI: If the Registry is Unconstitutional, Who is Liable? (Part II)
States sued over the registry often try to get the case against them dismissed on procedural grounds. Sometimes a state will argue that a suit is time-barred, not ripe, brought too soon, brought too late, or that plaintiffs lack standing.
Or, as in the example of this case, the state argued that we are simply suing the wrong people. In this case, the governor and the state police officials, who cannot be held liable, the state argues, for having enforced an unconstitutional registry.
Registrants failed to prove otherwise, according to the Federal Circuit Court of Appeals for the Sixth Circuit. Regarding the Michigan State Police (MSP), “many of the complaint’s allegations appear to target the behavior of local law enforcement, which the MSP directors did not supervise.” What about the governors? “The only connection between the governors and the alleged injuries is the governors’ generalized responsibility to enforce the law and their supervisory authority over the MSP.”
More details on this ruling can be found at Courthouse News.
For background on the more significant case that triggered this dispute, visit Michigan ACLU’s SORA Resources Page.
The only “push back” I see these past several years has been in State courts, and as has been shown here, each case becomes muddled and often lost on technicalities. I have no faith in the courts being change agents, since we continue to see evidence of their politicization. This approach could require confrontation in each of 50 states, and hundreds of issues that each need resolve. WHY is there no emphasis by responsible authorities to address this injustice at the legislative and federal levels? Seems we have learned that for states to manage this SO Registry system is too fragmented and confusing for users moving from state to state, especially since so many rules change. At the federal level, Congress could either abolish the Registry, or at least reduce its size to only seriously violent crimes. Our system makes NO sense and I see no progress beyond a drop in the bucket. Why? What will it take to make this a national issue? Why is not the inefficiency and draconian nature of SO management by Gov DeSantis in FL not a campaign issue?
Robert, I fear that the only (eventual) remedy will be for the registrant population in the US to grow so big and loud and defiant, that we skip the legal system in its entirety (in order to effect change). [Moderator’s note: be assured that we have no plans to abandon our ex post facto challenges or any other of our court challenges or legislative initiatives].
Am I advocacting for civil disobedience?
Maybe so…maybe so…
It seems to me that each time, throughout history, that a small hated class of people were singled out for brutality at the hands of the government, with broad populist appeal, that the (only) remedy was [moderated]!
Robert their is a principal involved in all this. If we all use a bit of logic, truth and understanding. The simple principal is do unto others as you would want them to do unto you.
Now who wants to be set up. Would not warning be enough. But law enforcement say we have the right to present ourselves as a child, ask for pictures… ( the dirty ones, I’m sure). We have the right to defraud you, deceive you and even lie to you. Sounds like the devil beating his wife to me or do we all fear evil. The main point is to bring true justice back to reality.wouldn’t all you agree.
We won’t see it as a campaign issue. People barely even see us as human beings. Florida is a one strike state. One offense no matter how small it may be and you are ‘persona non grata for the rest of your lif e.No matter what you may have done with your life or what you may do in the future. We no longer count. We screwed up once.Our lives are over as far as the “justice system” is concerned.The law is the law and “justice” doesn’t enter into it.When I think of the law I can only think of the Kangaroo version of it. One size fits all. Murderers have a better chance of living a normal life again than we do.
My opinion is that all 1 million of us persons forced to register must become united and demand (not ask for) our rights under the United States constitution!
The federal and state governments are currently playing fast and loose games with that cherished document! They are blatantly lying, bold-faced when they say that we are not being punished. This is a clear violation of our inalienable rights!
Until we take a bold stance, and until we become united and simply REFUSE to register, then they will continue to illegally bully, harass, and brutalize us!
We must all REFUSE to register en masse!
(You can’t make an omelet unless you are willing to break a few eggs.)
[Moderator’s note: We urge our members to comply with the law at all times, including those laws that we disagree with and are fighting in the courts, in the legislature, and in public opinion. The Moderator further notes that registration failures typically do not result in public sympathy for registrants].
I think that most states would be happy to arrest those who did this and get them behind bars where many would be killed by other inmates. Sorry but most don’t want to be a “broken egg” just to make a point that will go nowhere.
1 million out of 330 million is nothing and can easily be absorbed into the prison system. There will be no sympathy from the general public and most likely the exact opposite. SO are not quite the same as BLM in the mind of the public…NOT really a cause most can get behind.
DO A MILLION MAN MARCH ON THE CAPITAL.
I really wish registrants could gather together to protest and support one another but please keep in mind the dangers THAT would present. I’m sure I don’t need to elaborate on them. Couldn’t you imagine? I can’t be a martyr for our cause because my family still loves and needs me. If I’ve learned anything through all of this, it is who loves me. I do wish there was a way. My father is handicap and will need around the clock care soon. He’ll have to uproot and sale his home so I can be there for him. It is a sad injustice and our family’s pay dearly as well. 😞
Joy:
Unfortunately, there is no effective way for people on the registry to protest. They can’t refuse to register especially in states like Texas or Alabama (as recently reported on in our blog) where they will face spending the remainder of their lives in prison if convicted.
One commenter above mentioned sovereign immunity which is a political issue that has potential, but it doesn’t get rid of the registry.
JJJJ is not alone in being incredibly frustrated. Just read some of the comments here. JJJJ and others have a right to be angry because they have been stripped of their most fundamental rights and even their humanity.
What needs to be done is more networking and sharing of information. NARSOL has been pretty good with this, but these efforts have to be expanded. Also, attorneys involved with this issue should have a conference every year or two to share ideas and try to come up with a legal strategy on a national basis.
We preach to people like JJJJ to be patient, but we’re not the ones with a knee on our necks. We need to provide people on the registry with meaningful support while they endure these unconstitutional laws.
Yes!!!!
Just stop being so F***ing niiiiice about it!!!!
Your citizen’s rights
under the U.S. Constitution(!!) Are being abridged.
Maybe (just maybe) it’s time to act and speak out about it???
D’ya think???
Moderator:
You missed the point of JJJJ’s comment. He was saying to refuse to register as a form of protest, not to gain sympathy from an uncaring public.
What he suggested is not only practical but is already happening. Just look at registrants in Detroit. More than 40% of all registrants are noncompliant, not as a form of protest, but because of being burned out by the registry.
Of course, rather than check the Michigan registry for yourself you prefer to moderate my comments as you have done in the past simply because you can. When you change or delete portions of my comments rather than checking the facts, you are no different than the people who blindly support the registry. The same when you add comments to mine. You try to make me look bad and are insistent on having the last word but I have learned not to respond to a fool.
You added your comment to his in order to get the last word in because you know that no matter what he says you can always get in the last word. You even changed what he said in order to support your point of view and to prove him “wrong”. That’s pathetic.
I believe in the rule of law and that people should register if they are required to register until the courts strike down these unconstitutional laws. However, I’m not going to bury my head in the sand and ignore the more than 1,000 people who refuse to register in Detroit. I will respect them, JJJJ and respect the decisions and comments that they make.
I seriously doubt the moderator was trying to get the last word in. In fact, I KNOW that’s not the case.
To take JJJJ’s advise to stop registering is foolish and will get us nowhere except in a prison cell. I’m sure there’s probably some people who would interpret things literally here. There’s probably even new people browsing these comments who would read JJJJ’s comment and think it would be ok to stop registering. Do we want some naïve person ending up in legal trouble because he took someone’s bad advice? Certainly not. There’s much better ways for us to protest without breaking the law. Moderator was doing those people a good service and reiterating the importance of following the laws while we await court justice.
Its no different from when someone asks a legal question and I might answer it, but I ALWAYS state that I am not an attorney and to never take what I say as sound legal advice.
Please don’t be so hard on the moderators for this.
Not only that, but on the ASCOL site, there was a guy who suddenly appeared and was telling everyone how our Does II case was going to turn out and what it would mean for us. I kept telling him and everyone else that he was absolutely wrong about some key facts but not many people listened. In the end, he was indeed wrong and what he kept promising would happen never happened.
We all need to be careful with what we say because too many people who are hoping will take it as gospel.
Sir, no one is stupid enough to simply stop registering (all by themselves).
I think you underestimate the intelligence of people.
What I keep saying is simply that I believe that mass civil disobedience may be our only option. I am not talking about a few loonies. I am talking about a well-organized and well-planned movement comprising of, at least, tens of thousands of individuals across the USA.
I am talking about MASS disobedience.
Maybe this is a pipe dream. I don’t know, frankly.
But I DO know this: as long as we keep “taking it”, these sick, diarespectful bastards will keep dishing it out!
Bullies will continue to bully until the little guys stands up and says “enough!!!”
That’s my 2 cents worth.
I say to every person that is forced to register: “Quit being a sissy and STAND UP!!!”
Amen! Amen!
JJJJ:
The quickest way to get off of the registry in Florida or any other state is to support the Does litigation in Michigan. The courts have ruled that Michigan’s registry is punishment. This is going to severely reign in Michigan’s registry, and of course, provide the arguments that could lead to registries in other states to be found unconstitutional.
VOCAL is pushing for change. You can follow our progress at vocalhome.blogspot.com.
VOCAL is not pushing for a revolution and is not recommending that people refuse to register. We believe that change will only come through the courts which is a slow process.
VOCAL has one advantage in that we are not soliciting donations. Rather, we choose that people donate to litigation that is successful. Groups like FAC and ACSOL are soliciting donations so they would rather people donate to their own efforts. If ACSOL or FAC’s efforts were to become the most successful we can push for donations to their efforts. However, the only groundbreaking litigation right now is occurring in Michigan, so we are recommending that people support that litigation until more hopeful litigation develops.
We don’t have the resources for a website right now so the best that we can do for the moment is a blog. We aren’t much of a player in the registry fight at this point but do have a clear game plan to become relevant in the fight to abolish registries. Please be patient while we build our blog and get into the fight to ending these unconstitutional laws.
Maybe the legislatures who make the laws?
F.A.C. Moderators; You are doing a yeoman’s job reining in justifiable frustration.
We who are affected by draconian laws as well as obviously knee jerk revenge filled punishments are seemingly at our witts end sometimes and are secretly grateful for your much needed haltering although we might not admit it.
Thank you F.A.C. for all you do.
This is the problem with qualified immunity and it needs to go. It’s no different than when a cop seriously violates someone’s rights and they investigate themselves and conclude there was no wrongdoing.
Disgusted in Michigan:
I’m glad you know about qualified immunity. Sovereign immunity is a legal fiction created by the U.S. Supreme Court and needs to come to an end. Some politicians have suggested ending qualified immunity. This is a political issue with some potential that affects a broad spectrum of people, not only people on the registry. But first the public must be educated on the issue.
So is “strict liability.”
Strict liability is another quasi-ruling designed to keep the registry held together with very misleading data rooted in fear.
I have never in my life seen the political contortions, excuses and mental gymnastics used to keep a very, VERY bad law on the books. The degree of desperation is clearly predictable as SORNA is a harmful concept that is BARELY legal to begin with.